Would this work on a laptop with a USB 3.1 gen 2, but not thunderbolt, port, up to the 10Gb bandwidth? (which is virtually half the max speed of this RAID)
No. While Thunderbolt *controllers* are downward-compatible with USB 3.1, Thunderbolt *devices* are not. That said, it is within the spec to allow for "dual-protocol" devices - it is possible for a Thunderbolt 3 device to be usable over USB 3.1, where the Thunderbolt aspect of it is optional; but I don't believe any devices have implemented that. (Where the device would only operate using the USB channel.)
Personally, I wish device manufacturers would implement that - as well as DisplayPort+USB mode for "Thunderbolt displays", so that the Thunderbolt portion becomes optional.
So basically this is aimed at business sector because at $1999 US it is out of reach for about 90% of the consumers unless that 10% Pro consumer market will bite and buy these up. Would love to have this if they made something in the more affordable range for every one to buy up but keep the 2TB capacity
Your prayers have been answered. You can get the Samsung T3 USB3 SSD in 2TB form for around $700, and get roughly 3-500MB/s of throughput, which is all any reasonable person could even use today. If you want ridiculous numbers-for-sake-of-numbers performance, then you gotta pay the big bucks... that's the way it has, is, and always shall be.
Even 4K raw 24FPS is around 300MB/s, the CFAST card's you're likely recording to/copying from only read/write at around 3-500MB/s, so again, having the ability to read/write THE ENTIRE DRIVE in 17 minutes is basically pointless. Probably the only legitimate use for this drive would be somehow editing around 6+ 4K 24fps RAW streams simultaneously, or 2 4K 60FPS raw streams for a length of no greater than 20 minutes total. The industry doesn't care about you booting windows in 5.2 seconds off the $700 samsung vs 5.15 seconds off this monstrocity, so there's no incentive to bring down the costs or to get this into your hands.
Scrubbing thorough raw 4k footage smoothly while editing requires some serious bandwidth - more than simple transfers or other ordinary usage. I wouldn't be surprised if this kind of use maxed out the bandwidth in bursts.
Not to mention that professional cameras today shoot in far higher resolutions than 4k. RED has long had 6k sensors, and recently updated several of their camera bodies to 8k sensors.
Finally stock of LaCie Bolt3 STFF2000400 is available. 2,800 MB/s speeds for 6K video editing and daisy chaining. About pricing it is true- its quite pricy £1700 (https://www.span.com/product/LaCie-Bolt3-STFF20004... is not that cheap. But for sake of this speed i dont mind.
I'm surprised 2x M.2 SSD's and a controller would require an additional power connection. It certainly detracts from the portability if power over TB is not enough.
Consider that one samsung 950 pro can use 5.8 watt under heavy load. This thing has two drives, plus a raid controller. 12-15 watt TDP would be a rough estimate.
Unless every USB C port on every machine can push 15 watt guaranteed, this thing will have an additional power connector just to keep customer support calls to a minimum.
While every Thunderbolt 3 port must be able to provide at least 15watts of power, here is why the LaCie Bolt must use an AC adapter.
The Bolt has two Thunderbolt 3 ports to provide daisy-chaining capability, therefore, while it can be powered by the upstream port, the downstream port must be able to provide 15 watts to the next device in the chain if it is connected.
Only if the device had a single port could it be power cable free, like other external portable drives in the past.
Since LaCie had to provide an adapter, it makes sense that it also be able to offer the ability to charge connected devices as mentioned in the description.
Here are the questions a review should ask: 1. Can Bolt be used without the power adapter if there is no downstream device connected? 2. How much power is made available to charge or power a connected laptop or other device, in addition to the required 15 watts?
In summary, according to Thunderbolt connectivity rules, only devices with a single port can be solely bus powered. Dual port devices will always be required to provide an external power adapter, or power from the adapter.
This raises a question about the new Macbook Pro computers: 1. does the new low end MBPr supply the required 15 watts from each of the two included ports (30 watts total)? 2. do the other MBPr laptops supply 15 watts from each of the 4 included ports (60 watts!) plus powering the laptop?
Technically the high-end MBP needs to only power 3 TB3 ports while plugged in, since one TB3 port will be occupied with the MBP charger. (Similarly the low-end MBP only needs to power 1 TB3 port while plugged in.)
Of course, the question of what happens while on battery is a good one... You could theoretically plug in 4 15W TB3 devices while on battery. I don't see why the MBP couldn't handle that, though you'd go through battery life REAL quick in that case...
Funny how the photo with the unit on the desk looks soooo great and futuristic, but it doesn't show any cords running to/from the drive. Aesthetics uber alles I guess?
Wonder why it needs RAID 0. With a Samsung 960 Pro, it should be able to reach 3.5GB/s without RAID. After all, it just PCIe 3.0 x4 in an external box (minus some TB3 overhead).
Would like to see a review of Sonnet Fusion Thunderbolt 3 PCIe Flash Drive - 512GB.
LaCie has included Samsung M.2 PCIe SSD devices in previous products like their Thunderbolt 2 Little Big Disk, and other vendor SATA SSD devices in the Thunderbolt/USB rugged and Porsche Portable products.
Seagate had a short lived 600 series SSD for consumers, but it was discontinued. They have other SSD devices for Enterprise applications, but their prices make the Bolt3 prices look inexpensive.
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21 Comments
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takeshi7 - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
"Seagate, the owner of the LaCie brand, does not disclose which SSDs and/or RAID controller the device has under the hood"I think it would be safe to assume it uses Seagate's own enterprise M.2 SSDs. That's just speculation on my part though.
digiguy - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
Would this work on a laptop with a USB 3.1 gen 2, but not thunderbolt, port, up to the 10Gb bandwidth? (which is virtually half the max speed of this RAID)TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, November 3, 2016 - link
Doubt it, since this is a thunderbolt enclosure. Much like how plugging a thunderbolt 2 device into a displayport connector would do nothing.CharonPDX - Monday, November 7, 2016 - link
No. While Thunderbolt *controllers* are downward-compatible with USB 3.1, Thunderbolt *devices* are not. That said, it is within the spec to allow for "dual-protocol" devices - it is possible for a Thunderbolt 3 device to be usable over USB 3.1, where the Thunderbolt aspect of it is optional; but I don't believe any devices have implemented that. (Where the device would only operate using the USB channel.)Personally, I wish device manufacturers would implement that - as well as DisplayPort+USB mode for "Thunderbolt displays", so that the Thunderbolt portion becomes optional.
rocky12345 - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
So basically this is aimed at business sector because at $1999 US it is out of reach for about 90% of the consumers unless that 10% Pro consumer market will bite and buy these up. Would love to have this if they made something in the more affordable range for every one to buy up but keep the 2TB capacityc4v3man - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
Your prayers have been answered. You can get the Samsung T3 USB3 SSD in 2TB form for around $700, and get roughly 3-500MB/s of throughput, which is all any reasonable person could even use today. If you want ridiculous numbers-for-sake-of-numbers performance, then you gotta pay the big bucks... that's the way it has, is, and always shall be.Even 4K raw 24FPS is around 300MB/s, the CFAST card's you're likely recording to/copying from only read/write at around 3-500MB/s, so again, having the ability to read/write THE ENTIRE DRIVE in 17 minutes is basically pointless. Probably the only legitimate use for this drive would be somehow editing around 6+ 4K 24fps RAW streams simultaneously, or 2 4K 60FPS raw streams for a length of no greater than 20 minutes total. The industry doesn't care about you booting windows in 5.2 seconds off the $700 samsung vs 5.15 seconds off this monstrocity, so there's no incentive to bring down the costs or to get this into your hands.
Valantar - Thursday, November 3, 2016 - link
Scrubbing thorough raw 4k footage smoothly while editing requires some serious bandwidth - more than simple transfers or other ordinary usage. I wouldn't be surprised if this kind of use maxed out the bandwidth in bursts.Valantar - Thursday, November 3, 2016 - link
Not to mention that professional cameras today shoot in far higher resolutions than 4k. RED has long had 6k sensors, and recently updated several of their camera bodies to 8k sensors.edward1987 - Thursday, January 19, 2017 - link
Finally stock of LaCie Bolt3 STFF2000400 is available. 2,800 MB/s speeds for 6K video editing and daisy chaining. About pricing it is true- its quite pricy £1700 (https://www.span.com/product/LaCie-Bolt3-STFF20004... is not that cheap. But for sake of this speed i dont mind.boeush - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
"Seagate states that the Bolt3 was designed with long-term reliability in mind. This might imply that the device uses drives with high endurance"- and yet, a pathetic 2-year warranty...
etamin - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
I'm surprised 2x M.2 SSD's and a controller would require an additional power connection. It certainly detracts from the portability if power over TB is not enough.TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, November 3, 2016 - link
Consider that one samsung 950 pro can use 5.8 watt under heavy load. This thing has two drives, plus a raid controller. 12-15 watt TDP would be a rough estimate.Unless every USB C port on every machine can push 15 watt guaranteed, this thing will have an additional power connector just to keep customer support calls to a minimum.
m2inor - Thursday, November 3, 2016 - link
While every Thunderbolt 3 port must be able to provide at least 15watts of power, here is why the LaCie Bolt must use an AC adapter.The Bolt has two Thunderbolt 3 ports to provide daisy-chaining capability, therefore, while it can be powered by the upstream port, the downstream port must be able to provide 15 watts to the next device in the chain if it is connected.
Only if the device had a single port could it be power cable free, like other external portable drives in the past.
Since LaCie had to provide an adapter, it makes sense that it also be able to offer the ability to charge connected devices as mentioned in the description.
Here are the questions a review should ask:
1. Can Bolt be used without the power adapter if there is no downstream device connected?
2. How much power is made available to charge or power a connected laptop or other device, in addition to the required 15 watts?
In summary, according to Thunderbolt connectivity rules, only devices with a single port can be solely bus powered. Dual port devices will always be required to provide an external power adapter, or power from the adapter.
This raises a question about the new Macbook Pro computers:
1. does the new low end MBPr supply the required 15 watts from each of the two included ports (30 watts total)?
2. do the other MBPr laptops supply 15 watts from each of the 4 included ports (60 watts!) plus powering the laptop?
shelbystripes - Friday, November 4, 2016 - link
Technically the high-end MBP needs to only power 3 TB3 ports while plugged in, since one TB3 port will be occupied with the MBP charger. (Similarly the low-end MBP only needs to power 1 TB3 port while plugged in.)Of course, the question of what happens while on battery is a good one... You could theoretically plug in 4 15W TB3 devices while on battery. I don't see why the MBP couldn't handle that, though you'd go through battery life REAL quick in that case...
zodiacfml - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
Just wow. For the price, one make a decent computer which includes the same drives.slashbinslashbash - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
Funny how the photo with the unit on the desk looks soooo great and futuristic, but it doesn't show any cords running to/from the drive. Aesthetics uber alles I guess?bill44 - Wednesday, November 2, 2016 - link
Wonder why it needs RAID 0.With a Samsung 960 Pro, it should be able to reach 3.5GB/s without RAID. After all, it just PCIe 3.0 x4 in an external box (minus some TB3 overhead).
Would like to see a review of Sonnet Fusion Thunderbolt 3 PCIe Flash Drive - 512GB.
shelbystripes - Friday, November 4, 2016 - link
Probably because a (Seagate-owned) LaCie product won't have a Samsung 960 PRO inside?Just having PCIe 3.0 x4 available isn't enough, you need SSDs that can use all that bandwidth...
m2inor - Monday, November 7, 2016 - link
LaCie has included Samsung M.2 PCIe SSD devices in previous products like their Thunderbolt 2 Little Big Disk, and other vendor SATA SSD devices in the Thunderbolt/USB rugged and Porsche Portable products.Seagate had a short lived 600 series SSD for consumers, but it was discontinued. They have other SSD devices for Enterprise applications, but their prices make the Bolt3 prices look inexpensive.
chipped - Friday, November 4, 2016 - link
Jesus titty fucking!!! $1999?!?!!!They can shove it up their ass.
WylyQuimby - Thursday, November 10, 2016 - link
"LaCie this week has introduced its first external solid-state storage solution using Thunderbolt."LaCie has produced Thunderbolt SSDs before. The Little Big Disk series has SSD-only versions. This is probably their first Thunderbolt 3 offering.